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Hey there
I played a session last night. Was kind of active, I caught a nice run of cards (4 times Kings, twice QQ, and one AKs all of this within an hour!).
I got a stack of around 325 at that point. I open KK to $8 in mp, btn (reg, kind of standard i guess) 3bets to $25, and the sb calls (not much info about this player), comes back to me and i’m planning on a 4bet.Both villains have stacks of 150-175 behind.
I guess a standard 4bet could be around 100, maybe 125 since im oop. Let’s say I 4bet to 125, if one of them calls, they’ll leave themselves 50-75 in a $275 pot, if both call, they’ll have 50-75 in a $375 pot. If one of them 5bet shove, i’d call off.
On the other hand, I didn’t want to put a third of my stack in pf and see a A-high flop. And I don’t want to flat either (even if it could’ve been an option).
So I just shoved and they both folded. I was kind of happy with the 25-26 big blinds in dead money, but I wouldn’t have mind taking one of these stacks.
Maybe my 4bet was to big? Maybe a raise to 100-125 would’ve had the same effect, (or maybe even between 75-100?).
Maybe I’d get called by AK, AQs, QQ, JJ, TT (in sb’s range maybe?) and i’d pushed a raggy flop and would’ve been called by those overpairs under my kings…Or maybe my shove was standard? What do you guys think?
Thanks!There’s not much more you can do there with those stack sizes. Really awkward stack sizes. Even if you make it 75 and get 1 call, they only have 50-60% of the pot left in their stack. Betting 100 or 125 makes it even worse. Honestly, those guys shouldn’t call that, they should just fold or jam.
A shove is probably the right play here. I suppose you can raise to $100 and hope one of them jams on you, but I wouldn’t count on it. The problem is, at 1/2 with such short stack sizes, your 4-bet (no matter the size) is never a bluff unless you’re a maniac at the table. I think a lot of players are folding JJ and maybe even QQ here. Just jam and win the money.
John – I have to disagree with you; neither one of these villains is folding JJ or QQ because they’ll often assume you have AK. I’ve seen someone call a 4 bet jam with pocket 2’s because they thought they were up against AK.
Chuck – Whether you 4 bet smallish ($60-75) or jam, with the effective stack sizes, they’re either going with their hand or they’re not. You can’t do much about it; just be happy you got 3 bet and cold called instead of everyone folding. Variance – free money is a beautiful thing.
Edit to add: Think about the range of hands you would have raised here: would you be happy if you 4 bet AK and got folds? What about 88 or 9Ts?
I think your 4 bet sizing is dictated by factors outside your control as pointed out by others. Their play and stack size dictated yours. It’s good to take the smaller uncontested pot. All things considered, I would have either 4 bet shoved or called seeing a flop and playing from there knowing I’ll lose occasionally against two villains or even one but I will get stacks on occasion too.
Other factors that would influence my play that you didn’t mention was which time was this KK? First, second, third, fourth along with how I played others would guide my efforts to mix it up.
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