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Both these happened last night at live 1/2 at Stones in Sacramento
Hand 1:
Primary villain is pretty new to the table, but I did see him make one pretty light river call. both of us have ~200
Villain raises from MP to 4, 1 caller, I call from cutoff with KJo, both blinds call
5 players to flop, 15 after drop
Flop: K 3 K rainbow
Checks to me, and I check it through figuring there isn’t much I can get called by, hoping to get value on later streets
turn, 9d bringing 2 diamonds.
V bets 8, I call, others fold
river 3d
he checks, I bet 15, he raises to 30. I think for a bit and then shove, hoping to get called by a flush, a 3 (unlikely), and thinking at worst I’m chopping to another K. he snap calls with quad 3s.Hindsight being 20/20 the river is just a call, even with a flush he probably can’t call the shove on a double paired board, so I’m basically just hoping he shows up with a random 3. Am I wrong in my live thinking that an average 1/2 player can call here with worse?
Hand 2:
Later in the night, V is a really solid player, roughly in his late 20’s or early 30’s, he starts with ~150 and I cover.
I’m in CO with 55. 2 limps in front, I overlimp, button raises to 12, one other caller, I call.
pot 35
flop K5x, 2 spades.
checks to button who cbets 20, player in between folds, I raise to 50, he shoves, I call.
board runs out Kx, I show my boat, he has Pocket KK for quads.This one seems like a much more standard bad beat to me. I don’t see how I can ever fold a flopped set here. When he shoves he’s repping a pretty limited range and KK is maybe the most likely hand in that range, but I just don’t see how we get away from this. Tell me why I’m wrong?
I would not have done much differently in either case.
On the first hand, I think shoving for value on the river makes a lot of sense. Quads is a very rare hand (despite your immediate evidence to the contrary). You have top boat (except for K9) and are extremely likely to be chopping at worst. The rake is already maxed, so you’re not losing anything to the house by shoving and you just might win a big pot. Your opponent isn’t all that likely to have a 3, but it’s not impossible by any means. Lots of folks might min-raise A3s from MP pre-flop (not saying that’s necessarily a good play, but it’s not crazy). Bottom line, I think you played this fine and just got very unlucky.
Second hand is a no-brainer. You’re never folding in that spot for that price. Set over set is just a cooler.
Sorry for your bad luck. To have a boat beat by quads twice in one night is just brutal. Hope you run better next time! 🙂
Cheers,
DaveHey Pocket,
Hand 1: I think the only thing I would’ve done differently is not raise the river. Seems like you already know this. If you didn’t much behind on the river then I can see shoving maybe, but youre too deep for that play given your actual hand strength. This has to be a bet/call in my opinion. This is a losing play in the long run, if you want to think about it that way.
Hand 2: Nothing you can do about that one, just a bad beat and unlucky to run into quads twice on the same night, damnnn. Hope I helped a little bit!
Yea, I’ve kind of come to the same conclusion on hand 1. I’ve briefly considered if it makes sense to raise to like 70 if I’m going for thin value here instead of shoving, since that’s more likely to be called light, but then when he comes over the top am I really folding? Bottom line, as Dan said, is this needs to just be a bet/call.
Hand 1:
I don’t like your preflop line. KJo isn’t really good enough to call from this position, even to a min-raise. I like 3-betting with it a heck of a lot more than calling. Off suit broadway hands in multiway pots are big time losers unless you have the initiative. Kind of a pre-flop semi-bluff. Even if you’re behind, you usually have outs (and more importantly, position), and often times you just take it down preflop.You need to raise the turn in this spot to get some value. You’re usually ahead, and there’s no reason not to try and build a pot.
River should be just a call, even though it feels super nitty.
Hand 2:
Set over set for less than 100 bigs is trivial. Never feel bad going broke in spots like this; you’re supposed to go broke.
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