When to fold

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  • #3008
    Christian Basa
    Participant

    What’s the best way to play a strong hand if you don’t connect with the flop

    #3013
    Randy Brown
    Participant

    When you say “strong hand”, do you mean AA, KK, QQ? Or AK, AQ? With the former, you have showdown value. With the latter, you only have an ace.

    Did you raise pre-flop? Are you first to act? More info required.

    #3017
    Brad Owen
    Keymaster

    I usually just take the cards and throw them in the trash

    #3018
    Christian Basa
    Participant

    Sorry about the vagueness of the question. I was in the middle of a game when I posted it. Strong hands such as AK, AA, KK, AQ, hands like that when I’m on the button, first to act, or raised pre flop

    #3019
    David Wibel
    Participant

    That is a very difficult question to answer.

    So much is dependant on stack sizes, player type, your desired play style and game flow. If you are talking pre-flop you never fold AA, and it is almost always wrong to fold KK pre-flop. Post flop if the board runs out like 89J T and it’s like 3 spades and you don’t have one, I would be check folding with KK or AA just because there are now so many 2 pairs, straights, sets or massive draws that a button or BB call or a middle position raise-call.

    AK and AQ are different questions. Since without improving your hand you only have Ace high you play them for very different reasons and suited and unsuited combinations play very differently. AQ even from the button I won’t always 3 bet but I will raise, AK I will usually raise call, sometimes I will 4 bet jam if I am going to be fit or fold on the flop. AK and AQ if I have Top-top I will be happy to call down even unimproved. If I don’t improve on the flop I will probably see one extra street of pressure if I have some sort of backdoor or front door draw but with only Ace high calling down is a losing proposition. You will more often be semi-bluffing with these hands especially when you have gut-shots and flush draws, firing multiple streets but folding to extended aggression.

    #3020
    John S
    Participant

    Way too many factors to answer that question in general. Some factors I look at:

    How many players in the hand? Continuing into 1 player isn’t that bad, continuing into 3 or more isn’t a great idea. The more people in the hand, the more likely someone has something.

    Position. You should check more if you’re first to act and continue more if you’re in later position.

    Board texture. 752 doesn’t hit many players rangers, T98 hits a lot of pre-flop calling ranges.

    Opponent tendencies. Will the fold if they don’t hit the board (continue often), or will they peel one or two streets and try to steal on the turn or river?

    #3041
    Brad Owen
    Keymaster

    I agree with what others have said. There are plenty of variables you’ll want to consider. Most notably I would consider position, how many opponents are in the hand, their playing styles, and board texture. If you’re playing smaller stakes I wouldn’t worry too much about playing balanced or anything like that. To be honest, most people in low stakes games aren’t paying much attention anyway (if any).

    The hands that you mentioned are vastly different from one another. AA and KK are going to be the best hand on the flop a huge percentage of the time, particularly if the pot is heads up. I want to build big pots with large overpairs. I’m almost always betting flop for value regardless of position. Even if there are two, three, or possibly more opponents I will bet flop (with KK I wouldn’t if the flop is Ace-high). I will usually try to get at least one other bet in on either the turn or river as well. These hands are extremely strong and we’ll want to get two or more streets of value from them. If we get raised at some point then we’ll have to strongly consider folding depending on the opponent/situation.

    AK on AQ have a plenty of value as well, even if you don’t make a pair. A lot of times our opponent(s) won’t have pair and the flop either and we’ll be ahead. Usually when I’m out of position I tend to check/call with these hands on the flop. If I don’t improve by either making a pair or a some kind of a draw then I will fold if I’m facing a second bet on the turn. There’s nothing wrong with check/folding flop either. If I’m in position I’ll check these hands back a lot of the time. In the games I play I tend to c-bet King-high hands and lower as bluffs since they have a lot less value. I can usually get better Ace-highs to fold. If you do you want to c-bet as a bluff with these Ace-highs then I’d do it when there are opportunities for backdoor flush and straight draws. That way you can possibly pick up some equity and fire second bullets on the turn with possibilities of making the nuts. If you’re up against multiple opponents then I recommend not c-bet bluffing at all with these hands. Also, as some other people have mentioned you don’t want to bluff at all on boards that are very connected in which you have low equity. These would be boards like Td 9d 8s. There are plenty of straights, sets, two pairs, top pairs, drawing hands/combo draws that could be in your opponents’ calling ranges. It makes it a lot less likely you’d get folds.

    I hope this helps.

    • This reply was modified 6 years, 4 months ago by Brad Owen.
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