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That depends on how you view what you do. One type of person may want to track how well they do at the table by way of how good they make decisions. Winning and losing, and battling it out at the felt. Winning a bad beat, or part of it, sure as heck has nothing to do with your ability. Thus, the winnings from a bad beat would clearly skew your over-all numbers. Your hourly rate, your monthly and yearly numbers are all affected. Are you really making $xx/hr? Or did you throw in a lottery ticket?
Now, if all those number mean nothing to you, and all you are doing is tracking how big your bank roll is, then just throw it with everything else.
Lets start off by giving a direct answer to your question of: “Bad play?”. Not necessarily (no for short), but that doesn’t mean we should play any hand like a robot.
This hand requires knowing your opponents and the hand ranges you are able to put them on. The better you do this, the more the answer to your question changes. The UTG is betting big (for 1/2) in early position. You indicate this could very well be a big hand. Your call, following the CO call is fine. Folding is okay, but so is calling as long as you are able to re-evaluate on the flop.
The flop tells us a new story. UTG bets pretty strongly into the $40 pot, and the CO calls. What can they both have? Interestingly enough you put them on correct hand ranges. As the UTG is betting into two players who are both in pos he better have something that can stand a re-raise, but when the CO calls we need to ask ourselves, what does he hold? If it’s a draw which one is it? Small straight or flush draw? If it’s a flush draw, then you may be drawing thin especially if it’s a bigger one then yours (A,K, or Q flushes beat yours). So, do we automatically go all-in with top pair and a flush draw?
Wellllll, not so fast. You have Jc9c. Your top pair is easily behind any big pair, including AJ, KJ, and QJ. Sure, you have a flush draw to go with it, but the CO call, and the UTG play need to make us think more deeply. You actually did this in your analysis. If you are confident the UTG is more likely to hold a big hand in this spot, then you have little to no fold equity, but before we say that we have a flush draw that can increase our odds, we need to take into account the CO who cold called. If this is a flush draw, then our outs just diminished and our odds just went way down.
I know the books say to automatically raise here, but sometimes when we think about the situation as it plays out it may say otherwise. I can’t say your line is incorrect because so many say it’s correct, but at the same time I find myself analyzing these situations more and more, and when your hand range analysis tells you that you may be in danger, then it may be best to listen to your own analysis.
Your line is fine, and correct.
Raising pre with JJ is correct (anyone who says you should muck this is incorrect). Your opponents call oop with 9T is actually incorrect, and loose.
C-Betting the flop is also correct, once again your opponent makes a loose call. At this point he may have a Q or a flush draw.
At the turn your opponent hit’s one of his outs, but it gives you an open ender with one more card to come. Here you have two options, and both are acceptable.
1) Check and control pot size. Downside is if your opponent is on a flush draw you let him draw for free. Plus side, if he holds a Q you limit your potential lose. This is a solid standard route.
2) Continue with your line of betting (which you did) as you now have more outs to win the hand. This is a more aggressive approach, but acceptable play. At this point once you bet, and your opponent raises you are priced in due to size of your stack. So calling in this situation is correct.
Calling a pre-flop raise with J6s is a loose call. Best option is fold. A different line pre-flop is to re-raise, and utilize your position. This is a higher variance route without a doubt, but in short there are 3 options here.
Fold = Correct (standard tight aggressive approach, low variance, best of the 3 options)
Raise = Doable (but this is a loose aggressive approach, requires a larger bank roll and really good post flop play. High variance.)
Call = Incorrect (worst of the 3 options. Too passive, and loose.)The fold is too tight. Calling is your best option. The problem here is your inability to come up with a plan. You need to ask yourself what is my opponent betting with here?
He limped UTG and decided to call your preflop raise, and then raise your flop bet. With two clubs on the flop we can easily assess a potential flush draw, but as you are unsure of your opponents style a jack is not out of the realm of possibilities. However, his bet sizing makes little to any sense what-so-ever. His flop raise is too big for a J, so flush draws go up in likelihood. This does not mean a J is not in his hand it just isn’t the sort of play one would make with a J. You want to get paid by an over pair, not get an over pair to fold.
The plan of action is based on generating this type of information. A call is warranted on the turn. If he hits his straight it is well concealed and you will most likely pay him off. If a club flush hits, you can fold, but just about every other card in the deck is a call for you on the river.
A couple of things.
1. Straddling in UTG is the worst play in poker. Let others do it, not you.
2. Identifying your first opponent as tight, I’d doubt he’d be raising with holdings much weaker than AdTd, a call in your situation is fine.
3. Leading out is fine, check raising is fine. Both are good, though as your opponent is the pre-flop raiser, a check raise may be the better option.
4. Your check raise is too small. It should be an additional $150 or more. You are deep stack and there is a flush draw on board, make them pay.
5. At the turn you are unknowingly in trouble. I think the bet size is okay, considering you only called the flop. Your opponent should have raised and put you all in, he made a big mistake just flatting considering his stack size.
6. Tough fold based on pot size and amount to call, but with the original raiser betting out, and the BB flatting, it’s hard to believe your two pair are any good here. Only really good information on both opponents could say other wise.You are most likely losing money on this hand no matter how you change things up. The AQ isn’t going anywhere on that flop.
You want to work on your thought process. Lets start by simplifying the situation by removing physical tells. These are unreliable, so it’s best to focus on the fundamentals.
Pre-Flop: You min raise to $30. It’s normal to want to raise around 3x the main bet, but I will assume that with position and the one player in the hand you may be aiming to keep him from going anywhere. Your image may also play into this, but for now lets stick with this base assumption. The SB jams, and MP calls. Here you do a good thing. You take note of the fact that the MP player is loose. What does this tell you? Answer: He has a wide range of starting hands. Use this for the basis of your remaining thought process. Next question: Call or raise for isolation? Considering the current information, and your position, your hand most likely dominates a wide range of the MP holdings, so calling is actually a good play here. As a matter of fact, you really don’t have to consider isolation as you want to look for more money from such a player as the SB is already all-in. If you were oop and other players were also in the hand, then raising would make more sense. Lets move on.
Flop: 9QQ — MP shoves and you go into the tank. What does this tell us? There are a couple of perspectives here. 1. You are afraid to lose your stack on one hand (normal for many beginners) 2. You don’t know how to work through a decision matrix. Point #1 is psychological, point #2 we can work on.
Logical Thought Process:
A. Do most player jam all-in with a Q here, or do they check?
B. With 2 QQ’s on the board it is unlikely that my opponent holds a Q
C. My opponent is loose, and plays a wide range of handsThe answer to (A) is check…most people check. As a matter of fact, jamming with trip queens in a technically heads up situation is a bad play. Combine this information with (B) and what we know with (C) the odds of our opponent holding a Q are very low. You even made the mistake of putting your opponent on KQ when you hold KK, which makes that holding less likely. Calling is the best play here as the odds that your opponent is holding a Q is highly unlikely.
