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The only real way I see you getting half here with your badugi is if your opponent was dealt a hand like 2/3/4 of one suit and then ended up making a wheel with just two suits. I just dont think this is a profitable spot to be calling long term.
It’s been quite some time since I’ve put in hours at badeucy. Also the highest I’ve played was 9/18 or possibly 12/24 so take my advice with a grain of salt. Figured you may not hear back much here otherwise 🙂
I think it’s standard to lead after the second draw given that you were technically ahead draw wise. That being said being oop in a split pot game I don’t think you’re going to accomplish much and could potentially cost yourself multiple bets when raised. If you had a good/decent badugi then I would definitely be betting but since you have a 3 card 7 badugi (which imo is never good for half the pot) I am personally checking here.
Now after the third draw you can assume King high should never be good unless the player who stood pat is snowing here. I think given that you are out of position it’s possible since he saw that you drew, however again in split pot games you don’t see many people snowing here as they will often get called down when people are hoping to get half the pot. So that being said I personally believe King high shouldn’t be good a large percentage of the time. As for your three card badugi, you mentioned you had a good three card. Assuming I read this correctly you have a three card 7…that is not a good three card. A good three card would be a three card 5. Perhaps even a three card 6…a three card 7 is marginal at best.
So if this was me I would most likely be check calling after the second draw and then folding after the third draw.
Hopefully someone else can chime in here with more experience. Good luck at the tables!
Awesome discussion guys!
I agree with most everything that’s been said. I’m not sure you (Michael) understood the action on the turn if you’re expecting preflop raiser to cold three bet a straight flush. I agree that by raising he maximizes the chances that he stacks a king high flush since board pairing rivers can ruin this…however if he does raise then he almost surely shuts out the action player who lead the turn in the first place. Since preflop raiser has final action in this hand I would flat in his spot with the straight flush in hopes of allowing the player in between to get out of line. In fact you can even hope the river pairs the board which could give the third player in the pot a full house.
Now on to my decision on the river. I often find myself in these river spots not getting maximum value when I have a super strong hand that isn’t the nuts. It’s surely a mistake of mine but I often see monsters under the bed. In this spot I felt rather comfortable bet and calling off a raise because much like has been said wtf combo of 5♠️2♠️ can he have. Problem is you just don’t see people jam rivers as bluffs that often, especially when you yourself hold the key card (in this case the K♠️). You can say the 5♠️ and 2♠️ are the key cards since they’re the straight flush blockers but attempting to use them as the nut blockers is suicide IMO in this spot.
When he jammed I started talking out loud saying how can he have the straight flush. My thought was well it can really only be AA52 and I would expect him to bet the flop with that hand since he would have top set, a flush draw and a gutter. Still I just felt I was beat. He looked way too comfortable knowing I had the King high flush. In the end despite feeling like I was beat I couldn’t find the fold. He ended up having Q♥️Q♦️5♠️2♠️.
Obviously a terrible open on his part in a full ring 5/5/10PLO game from UTG+2
I guess we can say it’s a “cooler” but I think a lot can be gained from this regarding live PLO. Given that I believed he was competent I think we can remove him jamming worse flushes for value. If that’s the case the question is what is he bluffing with? You can say we can’t be folding the second nuts here or we are way too exploitable…but how often do you find that happening in live cash games?
I think one of the biggest arguments for not folding is my bet size. It signals weakness which he can be attempting to take advantage of. If he believes I’d bet larger with my nut hands it’s an easy jam for him with the queen high flush for value and bluffs to have me fold. This was ultimately the reason I believed I couldn’t fold. Now had I bet 4/5 pot can an argument be made for folding to a $400 raise getting 4 to 1?
I’ve just always been a big proponent of never thinking a huge hand is too big to fold. There are always reasons and spots to find a fold for even the second biggest of hands 😆
Anyway just a fun (or rather miserable) hand I wanted to share and get some insight on. Thanks!
Flop play is fine, as you mentioned stacks are going to get in no matter what you do. What is important is maximizing your opportunity to stack the spewy player. Considering you flop two overs and the nut gutter royal draw you aren’t going to get away from your hand. By betting on the smaller side you allow the spewy player to get in there with dominated draws. Once the flopped set raises I think it’s close between jamming and calling. I don’t mind calling to once again give the spewy player an opportunity to get it in bad. The only thing I worry about though is if he too flats how we’ll proceed on various turns. On board pairing turns are we jamming? How about an off suit 7? An ace could be deemed a good card to open rip but is it actually a bad card? I personally might just jam to avoid sticky situations and difficult spots on the turn. Considering your description of the player in between though calling is probably best.
Excited to join the discussion! Although it’s not in English, there are subtitles, this is one of my favorites. It’s called nosebleed and it follows two high stakes pros.