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Well I went back the next night, and took 9 hours to lose $440. Not happy about the money, but I definitely played better. Stopped playing out of position, and stopped with crap hands. The two major hands were a bluff attempt by me that was not great ($200 on fire) (i’ll post it for help whenever the forum lets me access the share your hand thing…anyone else having issues??), and then a sick 3-outer for $220.
Definitely should not have played a session that long, but I am happy with how I played. Gonna get back it tomorrow and hopefully get my graph going back upwards!
Cheers all
oh yes. So many hands out of position, or just marginal hands that felt good calling a pre-flop open, but would never be able to continue without flopping 2-pair. Or one stupid stupid stupid one where I flopped 2-pair on a monochrome board, and got it in bad on the turn against a higher two-pair w/ nut flush draw, and a flopped flush.
I’ll probably be going back tonight, but it will be with specific mind-set of playing tight ABC poker, and not chasing anything I punted yesterday.
1) stack size is effective with her at $147 (47 open, jams for 100). My image is pretty tight – I had folded JJs face-up a little earlier on a clean flop (was facing KKs, so go me). I don’t show down crap, and I don’t open wide. I didn’t like a jam – $1/$2 no one 4-bets light, so I thought I may be at best flipping – according to you I’m slightly ahead of her perceived range, but its still basically a flip. My flop plan was to get the stacks in if there was no A/K/J on the flop, and probably call down if its just a jack.
There is no standard open at this casino – sometimes its 6, sometimes its 13. Just depends on the table and who is currently there. This table was fluctuating between the extremes the whole time.2) yeah ok, kinda what I figured. At this table yes I’m c-betting half(ish). Its a looser table, so I am getting stronger value from these bets, and also trying to charge the draws they are (religiously) chasing.
3) Agreed it’s tough, but I ain’t folding and I ain’t limping. I’ll look more at my C-bet size, but I hate betting the same amount twice in a row (open to $10, then c-bet $10). I think sizing it up here would be better. As played, I wonder if I could size the turn bet up to $45ish and get him out.
Thanks gents
They let you straddle when you post missed blinds? That’s nice.
I’m fine with the pre-flop and your reasoning. I’m mostly ok with the flop call – part of me definitely says raise it with top/top, but if you then got re-raised you’d pretty much have to fold. Nasty board
Turn is fine. Button can’t re-open the action, so don’t have to worry about him. You’re probably not getting called by worse if you shove, so calling is fine.
River I like the check back. Its a side-pot if you bet, so you definitely won’t get called by worse.
Overall I think this a pretty good line, and you probably got max value from a weaker queen/jack on the button and maybe an UTG Ax flush draw or straight draw (K10, maybe even AK).
I definitely do not have any bluffs for my whole stack (double the max buy-in) here. Not sure if this would be a good spot to bluff in general, facing a bet/re-raise, but I’ll think about it…
As another guy said after the hand, “TFP – That’s Fuckin’ Poker”.
Villain snap calls pretty quick. Neither of us flip our hand. The board has a 5 of diamonds turn. Annnnd the river is the case 6. I show my hand right away, and he pretty disgustedly mucks his hand, claiming 99s. There’s a tiny part of me that doubts him, but I very much believe I just 1-outed him. And I take down my biggest pot ever, about $800…in a $1/$2 game no less.
Did you limp + 3-bet, or open + 4-bet? You say the SB raises, so not sure what the action is (although a $30 open would be massive, so open + 4-bet sounds right). Regardless, you should be opening with 10s, so hoping that’s the case.
Against a SB raise, I’m fine with a raise or call when it gets back to you. SB could be doing it light. When the SB calls though, it’s not going to be super light. Decent suited cards, connectors, or mid/high pairs.
Q85 monochrome is not really a great board for 10s, even with the heart. There’s a good chance SB can have (better) hearts, straight draws, or even some Qx. More importantly, what do you expect to get called by with this bet? A single pair probably won’t call, and neither would a single weak heart, but any nut/2nd nut flush draws, made flushes, two-pairs, and maybe straight draws with a heart.
Also, A/K/J of hearts by itself is a 42% chance to win, and they are getting 2.8-1 on a call, so I think they are getting the right odds to call. (someone check me on that, I always forget if it is ‘(pot + call)’ – ‘call’ (2.8-1), or just ‘pot’ – ‘call’ (1.8-1)).
So I don’t think you played it well post-flop. I think a check back would be better, and see how the turn changes things. You very well may be losing your stack if a heart comes (especially K/J), or if its all non heart under-cards for the turn and river. But there are good chances for you to then get away from it as well. Check-calling down is the most likely outcome, I think.
What do the rest of you think?
Agree with Mark….tight newby players will see tons of flops they shouldn’t, but will never bet at them without hitting them well
I would size up the C-bet a bit. That’s a somewhat scary board for KKs. $30 seems a better to me. Don’t know if it would have mattered this time, but still.
I am curious what you thought she was raising you with – is she a tight or loose player? A tight player, this is easily a call or even a (tight) fold. There’s just no real bluffs there. With a looser player a raise could be entertained, but even then you may not be getting the money in good. A10 spades is about a flip, something like 108 spades is ahead, Q9 is ahead, 99s, 77s, etc. So a call seems best
I think you did overplay it a bit, but I think folding would have been too weak. You’d have ~$200 left into a turn with a pot of ~$180, so if a spade or the ace comes you could have a good think then.
But what do I know?
The more I think about it I like the fold on the flop, and I could fold on the turn too. I get money from V2, but it only offsets my money going to John by a few bucks, so why risk it. Sucks to fold top-top, but I really should have
I agree, you’re jamming on this one. You have the 3rd nuts. I don’t think you are quite deep enough to be flat-calling. If anything, I’d say a flat call would look even stronger than a jam, and might prevent any more money from him going into the pot. But in reality, either one signifies that you are willing to put all your money in the pot.
Villain could have a lot of hands, and Ax suited is definitely in there (Kx too if he’s crazy). But there’s also a lot suited connectors/gapers and lower pairs.
Also, I think you mean the villain was on the opener’s left.
Cheers!
you play like a dumbass! Just kidding 😀
Hand 1, I think it’s mostly fine. $45 into a pot of $50 is pretty large though – I think it may be better to go about $30. That way he can still just flat and have about a 1/2-pot stack left. My concern is $45 might start your opponents playing perfectly – they will fold anything but their strongest hands to this. Now granted, you have the virtual nuts here (He’d 4-bet with Ks, I assume), but you may still be facing straight draws that would call 30 but not 45, etc. Overall I’d say its some-what opponent-dependent – if you know he’s getting the money in on that flop, then go for it.
Hand 2, I am fine with most all of it. My only concern is that OMCs often will fold strong hands to check-raises…they like to show they can make the big lay-downs too. That being said, if he opened it’s easy to put him on a strong pair that is going nowhere. So again, I think this is fine. 3x check-raise, and then you are correct to not call 170 with only 30 behind.
Sorry John, responded before I saw your post!
7) Yeah, I really should have, was just trying to be fancy I guess.
9) Honestly I don’t remember. You’re right though, I definitely should be betting it.
10) I know its big (Actually got a verbal exclamation from another dude at the table). I think I may flat next time, but I don’t mind taking it down pre-flop.
14) Yeaup, I should have called-down. I just did not believe him at all, and thought I could push him off whatever weak pair he had.
Thanks!!
1) Honestly I don’t remember. Pretty sure it was both blinds and a MP
2) 6 or 7 handed at this point – definitely a seat or two open, and this couple had smoke breaks every 45 minutes or so.
3) Yeah I know, I just couldn’t resist. I like mining for those small sets
7) I believe it was the BB and then the CO – it was checked to me, I checked, and he bet. The player in general was relatively tight, but he had been lamenting being card dead for a while (he’s a friendly guy). So I was expecting him to try and force something (which he did, I just didn’t catch it lol). I feel like I could have led on this – I have a pair, and its a decent flop for my range.
9) The raise came from EP/MP, I was about the HJ. The original raiser did not do the check-raise.
10) The SB seemed a bit looser of a player, but I don’t remember many 3-bets from him.
12) I probably should have sized up a bit. I was struggling to make sense of opening sizes this session, it was wonky what would get called and what wouldn’t.
13) Yeah, pretty sure it was 8- or 9-handed at this point.
14) Again, I agree, just wasn’t thinking properly on my opens. I also didn’t think through my play too well post-flop – I made the check-raise based off his bet without thinking about what I would have left behind. I agree that, if I am going to raise, it should be to about 35 or 40, but a flat seems a better option. In the end, I don’t think it would have changed much, I never would have given him credit for a premium holding
Thanks!!
Thanks for the input guys, I really appreciate it.
I’ll tighten up my range further. It’s interesting, I thought I was being tight-ish already lol.Do you think this format of posting works for this forum? I usually have a few hands per session to ask about, but I don’t want to clog up the forum with a bunch of posts all at once. (aka, I had another session where I did play tighter, but still lost the max)
I agree with John. Definitely you are allowed to raise here, and you definitely should be. And also yes, check the river back. It may feel weak, and when you’re good it’ll feel like missed value, but a check raise into a side pot after having opened and bet flop into a side pot. Seems strong. Additionally, V1 shoved pre-flop, so he is more likely to have the high pairs (aka no jacks), V2 could much more easily have a jack.
That being said, $300 to win a hefty pot might be worth the call. You’re effectively calling $300 more to win $1700 (total pots if you call). so what, 5.6 to 1, your call has to be right 18ish percent of the time. (I think that’s how it works out….someone please help me out there). Nasty situation though, I don’t hate a fold facing the raise.
